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How can a good God allow suffering

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Nov, 2016 11:36 am
@edgarblythe,
I don't understand why people refuse to accept nature for what it is. They need to believe in some pie in the sky to make life on earth have value. The short existence we have here is all there is!
What fascinates me is that we are the product of all our ancestors since man evolved on this planet.
I learned recently that us Japanese are really Korean based on our DNA. I wonder if scientists have gone further into our history that traces our roots all the way back to Africa.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Nov, 2016 12:44 pm
@cicerone imposter,
I am sure that if they have not started, they will. Plenty of people in those countries have got to be curious.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Nov, 2016 12:55 pm
@Smileyrius,
I'm in agreement that 'the purpose' is primary and that the plan can take unexpected turns. I just think the probability of that first 'fork in the road' was anticipated by God. I think it's possible that it went exactly as he wanted or anticipated but he gave us the choice anyway.

The path of a carefree existence with no problems to overcome is very appealing to me but I don't see much evidence that it leads to people developing the depth of character that I think God would find interesting.

The reason I'm not associated with any religion is the shallowness of their doctrine and most of their members. Many of them do great works of charity but are closed to examining and growing their understanding. Once established, their doctrine is off limits to questioning.

I'm as eager to see what's at the end of this road as anyone. You could be totally right about the easy path God would have preferred for us. I just can't help questioning everything while we wait.
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Nov, 2016 02:34 pm
@Smileyrius,
Smileyrius wrote:
...natural disasters are caused by a breaking down of nature...

How do you define "natural disasters?"
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Nov, 2016 02:44 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:
I wonder if scientists have gone further into our history that traces our roots all the way back to Africa.

Massive Genetic Study Supports "Out of Africa" Theory
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Nov, 2016 02:46 pm
@InfraBlue,
"Natural disasters destroying nature." If it's natural, how does it hurt nature?
0 Replies
 
francisass
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Nov, 2016 05:13 pm
@SawyerMentink,
I’m a retairded Professor from Georginia. Sometimes I feel it’s a shame I’m an atheist, otherwise I’ll call myself GOD.
0 Replies
 
glenmedved
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Nov, 2016 09:54 pm
@SawyerMentink,
because it will be undone in life's time. Completely. Imagine if someone lived a perfect life since the moment they began to suffer. Trust me, have faith in this.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Nov, 2016 09:02 am
@Smileyrius,
Quote:
There are many things that lead me to believe we are on a detour from Gods intended purpose, and that this was not planned. I’ll raise just one as a ponderer.

Why did God feel regret before the flood?
Forgot to address that question in my last post.

I agree that the flood was indeed a detour that God would rather not have had to deal with. But I think there is a difference between that one and the one in the garden with A&E. The flood was the result of mankind largely rejecting God. A&E did not necessarily turn against God, or at least I don't see any indication of that in the text. My read on it is that they made the choice to know good and evil even if it meant they would eventually die.

In all honesty, I would have likely made the same choice because I couldn't bear the thought of not knowing the reality of existence, no matter how nice the physical conditions around me were. This would in no way mean that I reject God himself.

Of course it goes without saying that I could be wrong about A&E's motivation.

cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Thu 3 Nov, 2016 10:03 am
@Leadfoot,
Nothing to do with any God. It's called nature. Tsunamis and fire started by lightning have killed thousands in modern times.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Nov, 2016 10:14 am
@cicerone imposter,
Yeah! One more 'There is no God!' from CI.
0 Replies
 
glenmedved
 
  0  
Reply Thu 3 Nov, 2016 10:02 pm
@SawyerMentink,
Only if God allows suffering in God. The 1980s decade lasted for 500,000 years. In 1977, God told Jesus not to enter into a transexual booth bar. However, Jesus did either way. In 1980, came same-sex thinking. Let's just say Jesus was used. However, not in the right equational amount, as he defied God. God was mad.

Our beloved shot God, in the face of an evil one, a face of a god, perhaps not a prince, but definitely John. August 8th, 1989. And now we deal with suffering.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Nov, 2016 10:06 pm
@cicerone imposter,
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/12/1227_041226_tsunami.html
0 Replies
 
Christian0912
 
  0  
Reply Fri 30 Dec, 2016 11:21 pm
@DannyR634,
And that is where you are wrong. So obviously youre an atheist and you believe in the theory of evolution. I'm guessing there. Just for a second imagine yourself as not an atheist, not a believer, but as someone who stands on neutral ground. Just look at the theory of evolution. One theory is that the crust slowly came to form... out of nothing. Then it grew into the world, the galaxy grew around it, the Sun popped out of nothing and BANG! everything is created in perfect harmony to allow for humans to live, seasons to work, tides to work, etc. Does that sound correct? Or maybe you believe in the theory of the primordial soup. That the atmosphere created certain chemicals, which in turn created a 'soup' which living organisms crawled out of into the earth, and grew into humans. Where did the atmosphere come from? Someone had to create it, or was it always there. Or, maybe it created ITSELF, out of... nothing...
No. That's not it. And if you're standing on neutral ground, you would certainly have realised that by now. There are so many other reasons for the existence of God. if I went through all of them, it would take me a long time. How else could the world have been created!? How many other wacky weird theories will you atheists come up with, before you run out of ideas, and realise... God is real.
I could go on forever, but I won't. Instead I'll ask you one simple question.

Even if God is not real, what have you got to lose?
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Dec, 2016 03:52 am
@Christian0912,
Christian0912 wrote:

And that is where you are wrong. So obviously youre an atheist and you believe in the theory of evolution. I'm guessing there. Just for a second imagine yourself as not an atheist, not a believer, but as someone who stands on neutral ground. Just look at the theory of evolution. One theory is that the crust slowly came to form... out of nothing. Then it grew into the world, the galaxy grew around it, the Sun popped out of nothing and BANG! everything is created in perfect harmony to allow for humans to live, seasons to work, tides to work, etc. Does that sound correct?


Are you trolling? Because if you are not, your understanding of the steps of how the universe progressed is flawed.

First of all I need to mention that evolution of life is different than how the universe formed. You can believe in cosmology and its hypothesises and not believe in evolution. They are two different things.

Second, no the Earths crust didn't come from nothing.

Let me try to explain. The big bang theory is a derogatory term. People constantly say there was a point in the past where a very small highly dense point exploded and expanded creating space.

But let me fill this in with, nothing exploded. Sure there was a singularity that had nothing outside it. It didn't explode but instead it inflated. Expanded and continues to expand.

Now there were no stars, planets, asteroids in the beginning for hundreds if millions of years because the young universe was TOO hot for atoms to form. Only after the universe cooled down did atoms form.

These first atoms were mostly hydrogen and helium atoms. The universe was not uniformly equal so there were dense regions which the first super massive stars formed. They were huge and burned fast. Probably only existing for a few hundred million years before they collapsed to form the first massive black holes.

These massive black holes pulled in more surrounding gas due to intense gravity fields. When this happened they started to form galaxies. Which densely compresses the hydrogen gas creating stars.

Our sun, is probably a third or fourth generation star, meaning it was created when stars before it, exploded spewing out its elements into space.

Stars compress atoms together due to their intense gravity and heat. This process is called fusion. Combine two hydrogen atoms, you get helium. You can also compress two helium atoms together which form Beryllium. You can also compress one Beryllium atom with another helium atom to form a Carbon atom.

Anyways stars die and when they do they explode sending heavy elements scattered into space.

Our sun, the Earth and the rest of the planets plus the iron in your blood, the calcium in your bones, the water, everything you see was once inside a star that exploded billions of years ago.

The Earth firmed slowly by this debris of rock and gas. Slowly clumping together over millions if years. In fact the Earth is still getting bigger, the Earth gains five tons of new material every year.

So no the Earth didn't magically arise out of nothing. But if you really want to get technical, atoms are mostly made of nothing.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Dec, 2016 07:58 am
@Christian0912,
Quote:
Even if God is not real, what have you got to lose?

I always thought that Pascal's wager was a weasely approach. Has that ever worked for anyone? Even the book says to be hot or cold. Atheists are do'n it right in that respect.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Dec, 2016 11:49 am
@Leadfoot,
Atheists have it right because we don't rely on hokus pokus. We try to understand the underlying science in how everything works. It's the only process that corrects itself as more information is learned.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Jan, 2017 09:43 am
@cicerone imposter,
I get it CI. You are not only cold, you're frozen.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Jan, 2017 11:51 am
@Leadfoot,
Ad hominem.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Jan, 2017 11:58 am
@cicerone imposter,
So you are saying you are not cold or frozen to the idea of God?
It seemed pretty clear in many of your posts that you are.

Is that not so?
0 Replies
 
 

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