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Legality of an IRA vs last wishes in a Will

 
 
Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 07:35 am
My grandmother passed away earlier this year. She wrote in her will and had openly told all of her children and grandchildren that she wanted her assets divided equally. She has 4 children, each receiving a 25% stake. One of her children, my father passed away 7 years ago. As her will is written, I receive my fathers 25% stake. However, as it turns out, my grandmother's IRA was set up in 1991 with just her four children listed as beneficiaries before any of them had children. Flash forward today, the three surviving children are the surviving beneficiaries on the IRA. Despite my grandmas state wishes and wishes in her will, because she never updated her IRA beneficiary to include her grandchildren. Under law, I am not party to the 25% that was due to my father. Beyond the financial ramifications of this, it feels ethically wrong. The three other children are dividing that 25% share amongst themselves and have told me that legally they are doing nothing wrong. I think that they are immoral. I ask the community to help me see both sides to this, the ethics and let me know your take on the situation. I am writing this because I am having trouble seeing all sides. It looks to me like those three children are letting this happen because they just want the money.
 
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 07:46 am
@normans13,
It sounds to me that you are correct about the "ethics" of the situation. If I were your cousin, I would share this money with you. Unfortunately I don't think that ethics matter one bit in this situation.

This is a legal question. The only important question is what the law says. Hopefully you have talked to a lawyer in your state. If you haven't, then you should.

My two pieces of advice are

1) Talk to a lawyer. In my experience it is good to pay a lawyer one or two hundred bucks for a bit of their time.. this way they will give you advice rather than a sales pitch, and ask them what their opinion is of your chances in court.

2) If the lawyer says you don't have a case, then move on. I might stop sending my cousins Christmas cards... but it really isn't worth much to fret about this. Life isn't always ethical.


0 Replies
 
jespah
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 08:01 am
@normans13,
This is what you hire a lawyer for.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 08:24 am
@jespah,
Part of the question was about ethics, Jespah. No one hires a lawyer for ethics, do they?
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normans13
 
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Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 08:56 am
Thanks, appreciate the thoughts. They have the law on their side. The beneficiary portion of an IRA overrules anything that is said or written in a will. It's a nuance in the language of "Per stirpes vs Per capita." Since there were no grandchildren at the time, she set it up without them in mind, 25 years later this issue comes up when she passes since my father, one of the beneficiaries has passed as well. ---The big thing for me is I am just trying to figure out, if maybe I am ethically wrong here, because I am thinking the same thing about not wanting to send christmas cards anymore. One of the Uncles says that this is what she intended 25 years ago and I then replied, well why then did she publicly say otherwise and write differently in her will. He didn't have an answer. He just said this is the way it is and he cant change the IRA beneficiaries. But the big elephant in the room is that they can let this money be distributed and then after the fact even things out by giving over a few years. And since they wont acknowledge this or that the IRA may not have represented my grandmothers wishes. I am concluding that they just want the money, right or wrong. And I find myself wondering if there is more ethically going on here or is it just that simple because I dont know how they can sleep at night, doing this to their family.
jespah
 
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Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 09:15 am
@normans13,
You should still hire an attorney (sorry for missing the ethics part of the question but let's face it, this is about the cash, amirite?).

Beneficiary portions of separate financial instruments usually override more general statements in wills BUT this is for a lawyer to determine through research.

The uncle is not qualified to divine the decedent's intent. Again, this is what the practice of law is about, to help interpret the nuances of language.

If there is a question about a distribution, calling a lawyer is Job One. It's not a hostile act and should not be interpreted as such. It is to understand the decendent's wishes as they correspond to the law.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
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Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 10:24 am
@normans13,
You should definitely contact an attorney. Your father is a beneficiary so the proceeds might go to your father's estate which would then be divided per his will. IRA's may be different, but we had a similar situation where my grandmother died, then another relative died and willed everything to my grandmother so then those proceeds fell through to her beneficiaries. Note the the IRA manager should be doing everything per the law without any assistance from your uncles and aunts. You could just talk directly to him/her and ask the scoop.

As for your relatives, don't sweat this and don't sever any connections. You didn't earn this money so while it would be nice to get some free money, it's not like you aren't getting something you deserve.
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McGentrix
 
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Reply Fri 6 Nov, 2015 01:07 pm
I'd make some other friends in the IRA and have them bomb your relatives. The Irish folk don't put up with a lot of nonsense and that is what it sounds to me like. Fook em all the English bastards.
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