Are American's capable of joining cults like Jonestown today

Re: Are American's capable of joining cults like Jonestown t


What are you asking?



Yes you are missing the part where you realize humans join cults for more than just one or two reasons.



People do silly things for different reasons. I'd say a minority has the predisposition for something like cult suicide but did kamikaze polits make more sense?



Dunno, but I will say that you frame your questions in really silly ways.

In the first question I am asking if Jonestown and others happened because Americans had not seen a relevant example of cult activity - but today we have - and it would make us aware not to join one. Have we learned from our past - or are we just a susceptible of joining a Jonestown type cult today.

In the second question I am not suggesting that people only join cults for this reason - I am asking if the 60's (and its social unrest) was a greater breeding ground for cult activity.

In the third question (3.0) I am not suggesting that Kamikaze pilots make more sense but wonder if Kamikaze pilots have the same types of mentality as cult members. (Are you suggesting that the Japanese air force is a cult?)

In the fourth question was a typo that I have sense corrected, but I am wondering if we are all capable of joining cults are we really as advanced as we think we are?

TF

p.s. Thanks for the reply and I appologize for the lack of clarity in framing my questions. I can see after rereading my post that my 'silliness' could get in the way of your trite replies.

Who the heck is this "we"?



During the hippy years there were more people doing activities similar to cults in America.

Yes, many cults sprung up during this time.



Nope, Í'm suggesting that there are non-cult stupidities that easily rival cult stupidities.



I'm not sure cults have much to do with advancement. I was born into one and never was faced with a choice that resulted in me saying yes (was faced with a choice of hacking it on my own or coming back to the cult at about 11 or 12 but my tenure in the cult was one of birth).

The people who did join the various cults I have studied seem to all have had a need to fit in and belong to something.



You won't find many people who know more about cults than I do, so thank your lucky stars. ;-)

Touche' on the 'we' comment. I forget (being new) that this is an international board. I am very used to posting on a intranational boards. Sorry for the niavete'.

I am not arguing that cult mentaility is advanced. I am saying that if we are all equally capable of being drawn into a cult does this not say that we are not as 'rational' and 'critical' as we think we are. (This we is refering to we humans )

I can understand being born into a cult - but I do not understand voluntarily joining one. What do you think (with your unique expertise) drives people to join and then stay commited to a cult that has so many negative consequences (like Jonestown)?

Is it just the need to belong like you stated above?

TF

I think people join for a lot of reasons individual cults are not monolithic and neither are the larger group of cults.

I'd say a sense of meaning and belonging is a big reason but that is just one.

There are a lot of people who write of their own reasons for joining, you can read a lot about them online:

Here is one person relating their experiences in the cult I was born into:

http://www.factnet.org/cults/children_of_god/experience_i.html

Here is an interesting site:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/cultmenu.htm

It happens to be more favorable to cults than I'd be, and it claims the cult I grew up in is unjustly targeted while I beg to differ but that's a good start.

Here is a site run by a person who is still religious but who attacked the cult he had joined to the point they prayed against him:

http://www.watchman.org/jw/index.htm

Within his writings you can find some of his "testimony".

Here is an exer site with many articles from ex members:

http://www.exfamily.org/art/



That was the result of a 2 minute search, you can certainly find much more and follow links to many other places.

But to be brief there are many reasons, some you might not even imagine (e.g. joining for sex).

Thanks for the replies. I will continue my reading.

TF

i think the post-bush-election republican party answers your question

Are Americans capable of joining cults like Jonestown today.

Americans, in my experience, are capable of anything.

Steve,

I think that you are unwarranted in your limiting unconventional behaviors to Americans. There are enough weirdos around for every town in the world to have at least one.

Of course agreeing on a definition of weird may be another problem

It seems every couple of years there's cases of cults and mass suicides, though not nearly in the same magnitude.

I don't remember the exact specifics, but the last one was in the Los Angeles area when the latest comet flew past the Earth. And before that I remember cases in Toronto and Switzerland.

Yes, it's still possible for another Jonestown. Religion does funny things to people, even quite intelligent ones. Not all suicide bombers are dummies. Almost anything can be rationalized by the human mind.

Jim you are thinking of the Heaven's Gate Cult. They thought that a space ship was hiding in the tail of Haley's comet to take them away.

But this was such a small group in comparison to the over 900 that Jonestown took with them (not to mention the first congressman to be assasinated in the history of the US).

I wonder if we really are that stupid anymore... I guess I can empathize with many things - but this one has me stumped.

TF

p.s. Stuh - for once brother you and I are on the SAME page.

I don't really think that it's a matter of stupidity, but rather being incapable of seeing what relation your "one true faith" has to the rest of human experience and other people's religious experiences . A lot of people can be convinced of almost anything, given the right circumstance. Cults tend to gradually insulate members from the outside world so that their own perspective becomes more convincing. It doesn't only happen in terms of cult membership, but also getting a country to believe that they are the "good guys" in a war or adopting the roles required to become a member of any clique or profession.

As the demands expected of cult members increase, more force is required. By the time that the mass suicide of Jonestown occurred, the leader was using more threats of physical violence to keep people in the group. Even the most successful cults recruited only a small number of people who attended the initial sessions.A lot of filtering occurs and folks who are most likely to counterargue aren't likely to stay that long.

I'm not sure I agree with your initial statement, anyhow. Consider the probability of that event occuring at any time, how many mass suicides occurred as the result of membership of any cult in the 70s through to the present. Unless you can produce a substantial number of other instances of similar events occurring, you can't be sure that it wasn't due to chance. Besides which, cults still exist. As well as Heaven's gate, the stand off at Waco with the Branch Davidians ( in which 80 died) occured in 1993. There have been other instances.

(http://www.apologeticsindex.org/b10.html#jury)


America strikes me as an extremely insular society, hardly as sophisticated and world-wise as they like to believe. IN many ways, Americans aren't exposed to the diversity of other cultures and beliefs as smaller countries, for all their talk about being the great "melting pot".

People in cults don't think of their cult as "a cult", that's a label that other folk give . People who are drawn into the cult don't draw comparisons between "The order of the Flying monkey" and "Heaven's Gate". The typical recruit is too young to have any recollection of the Jonestown massacre ( they are usually under 25), unless they have read the history books, and typically from protected backgrounds ( characteristically middle class, where they don't have the "street smarts" of the very poor or the warnings about kidnapping which are given to the upper class.