What is the subject of "were"?

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Context:

He had had some success in public speaking as a student, and that along with his burning conviction of having a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself were his only assets. It called to mind the Hebrew prophets and was a magnificent adventure of faith.

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Type: Question • Score: 6 • Views: 1,423 • Replies: 23

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View best answer, chosen by oristarA

@oristarA,

1. Success in public speaking.

2. Burning conviction.

1 Reply

@Lordyaswas,

Lordyaswas wrote:

1. Success in public speaking.

2. Burning conviction.

Well, if so, there should be "that" before "He had had some success":
That he had had some success... "Two thats were..." sound okay. Without first that, it seems ungrammatical.

1 Reply

@oristarA,

"That" here is a pronoun referring to "some success in public speaking".

It's perfectly grammatical, and his lordship is perfectly correct.

Put a comma after "that" and you'll understand it better.

....and that, along with his burning conviction of having a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself, were his only assets.

1 Reply

@McTag,

McTag wrote:

"That" here is a pronoun referring to "some success in public speaking".

It's perfectly grammatical, and his lordship is perfectly correct.

Put a comma after "that" and you'll understand it better.

....and that, along with his burning conviction of having a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself, were his only assets.

Excellent.
But I haven't fully grasped the meaning of "of which he must deliver himself".
It seems to refer to "of the soul he must deliver himself". What does deliver mean here?

1 Reply

@oristarA,

Quote:

a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself

a burden......which he must get rid of.
.....which he must shed
(Americans might say: which he must lose)

2 Replies

@McTag,

McTag wrote:

Quote:
a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself

a burden......which he must get rid of.
.....which he must shed
(Americans might say: which he must lose)

So "he must deliver himself" means "he must release himself from the burben"?

1 Reply

I would re-write the sentence, since in my opinion 'that' should refer to a single item.

His success in public speaking as a student, and his burning conviction of having a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself, were his only assets.

1 Reply

@contrex,

Quote:

I would re-write the sentence, since in my opinion 'that' should refer to a single item.

"That" does refer to a single item.

"that, along with..."

1 Reply

@oristarA,

Quote:

So "he must deliver himself" means "he must release himself from the burben"?

Yes, but the phrase is "which he must deliver himself OF..."

0 Replies

@McTag,

McTag wrote:

Quote:
I would re-write the sentence, since in my opinion 'that' should refer to a single item.

"That" does refer to a single item.

"that, along with..."

But there's a "were" later on, and "assets" (plural).

He had had some success in public speaking as a student, and that along with his burning conviction of having a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself were his only assets.

Everything from 'along' to 'himself' is parenthetical - you wouldn't say "His burning ambition were his only assets". It needs fixing, e.g.:

He had had some success in public speaking as a student, and that, and his burning conviction of having a burden on his soul of which he must deliver himself, were his only assets.

'Along with' doesn't join the two things together into a plurality.

That's what I feel, I may be wrong.

[UPDATE] I found a reference

http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/sv_agr.htm

The topic is subject-verb agreement.

Quote:

Phrases such as 'together with', 'as well as', and 'along with' are not the same as 'and'. The phrase introduced by 'as well as' or 'along with' will modify the earlier word (mayor in this case), but it does not compound the subjects (as the word 'and' would do).

The mayor as well as his brothers is going to prison.
The mayor and his brothers are going to jail.

1 Reply

@contrex,

Ok I can see the sense in that.

It doesn't look wrong to me in its original form, but to refine it, the verb could be made singular.
However the author evidently means that both these things were his main assets..so maybe we should insert an "and" and leave it plural.

0 Replies

@McTag,

As an American, I wouldn't use the word "lose".

Deliver here has more of the meaning of "save" or "rescue".

He most lose himself of a burden on his soul-- sounds funny.

He must save himself from a burden on his soul.
I must rescue himself from an burden on his soul. -- OK

The use of the preposition "of" sounds strange to these American ears in any case.

1 Reply

@maxdancona,

McTag wrote:

Quote:
So "he must deliver himself" means "he must release himself from the burben"?

Yes, but the phrase is "which he must deliver himself OF..."

Failed to get the meaning of "OF", McTag.

What does it mean here?

Max has taken the words out of my mouth:

maxdancona wrote:

As an American, I wouldn't use the word "lose".

Deliver here has more of the meaning of "save" or "rescue".

He most lose himself of a burden on his soul-- sounds funny.

He must save himself from a burden on his soul.
I must rescue himself from an burden on his soul. -- OK

The use of the preposition "of" sounds strange to these American ears in any case.

1 Reply

@oristarA,

I thought it was the sentence that had a subject and a predicate?

To paraphrase, "His public speaking and burning ambition were his only assets."

His assets are the subject and the rest of the (edited) sentence is the predicate, as far as I know.

I'd love to hear from experts on this because I was largely away most days.

0 Replies

@oristarA,

Quote:

Failed to get the meaning of "OF", McTag.

What does it mean here?

Max has taken the words out of my mouth:

1. If you prefer to take your instruction from Max, good luck.

2. "Delivered of" is an old construction, not much seen nowadays. I hesitate to give examples; it sounds almost biblical to me.
"she was delivered of a son"= she gave birth to a boy.
(It turns the active into the passive)

2 Replies

@McTag,

Quote:

If you prefer to take your instruction from Max, good luck.

Geez McTag. I didn't know you were so insecure. Don't you think it is a good thing if Oristar gets input from more than one native English speaker? You don't have to be so territorial.

1 Reply

@maxdancona,

I welcome the diversity of A2K. I don't know about insecurity, though. Did I criticise you?
A foreign learner like OristarA has his own way of looking at things, will not at once understand subtleties, and will not always know when he is getting good advice or bad.

I'm surprised you did not recognise the American slang usage of "lose".

"You want my advice, lose the moustache. It doesn't do anything for you."

1 Reply

@McTag,

McTag wrote:

Quote:
Failed to get the meaning of "OF", McTag.

What does it mean here?

Max has taken the words out of my mouth:

1. If you prefer to take your instruction from Max, good luck.

2. "Delivered of" is an old construction, not much seen nowadays. I hesitate to give examples; it sounds almost biblical to me.
"she was delivered of a son"= she gave birth to a boy.
(It turns the active into the passive)

Would you like to use another phrase to substitute "delivered of"? So that I can better understand it.

1 Reply

@McTag,

Read my post again.

I said "As an American I would not use the word 'lost'". The qualifier in my statement is importnat. I am fully qualified to speak as an American and my hope was that the point of view of an American would be helpful to Oristar.

In my other example I noted that the construction "lose himself of... " sounded funny. Again, I making a subjective statement as an American (although I suspect most American speakers of English would agree).

As an American, your response seemed rather snooty.

1 Reply

What is the subject of "were"?

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