Tough Love or Questionable Parenting

@Setanta,

I'm just saying that, as a parent, it's not really appropriate to point out, or make your kid feel undeserving of, things like food, shelter, and clothing.

1 Reply

@Ceili,

I was amused at how pretentious the guy was.

"Your silly security settings are no match for my IT skills!"

"I shoot bullets that are $1 apiece!"

It's like lines from a bad (really bad) Kung Fu movie.

1 Reply

@DrewDad,

I didn't suggest that a parent should say that, certainly not that they should do anything to sugggest that a child is undeserving. You're just using that as a polemical stance to criticize my point of view. One can as readily point out that a family is a community, to which each member is expected to contribute according to their abilities. Spare your self-righteousness for something more worthy of its florid expression.

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Please note the use of the word "or."

Pointing out food, shelter, and clothing is inappropriate, as well, just not as inappropriate as suggesting that a child is undeserving.

Saying to a child "you owe me chores because I feed you" is inappropriate. Whether that is what you meant to say, or not, doesn't really matter to me.

It's not about you, or trying to criticize you.

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@DrewDad,

Yup, I was amused how he tried to come off sounding sooooo "I'm smarter than you" but had a hard time reading, putting a sentence together, smoked, littered and then he pulled an Elvis Presley. For the love of god, he's a moron. He's no Clint Eastwood.
If there was a lesson in there, I think it backfired..

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@DrewDad,

I think it is fair to say that everyone in the family has responsibilities. Parents bear the lion's share in providing food, shelter, clothing, etc. A typical child's load is small in comparison and should be borne without complaint. I don't think the implication is that the child is undeserving of basic necessities, only that the child should recognize that what she takes for granted is given at the expense of the parents' time and toil and that the relatively small things she is asked to do in return represent only a small part of what is required to maintain a household.

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@engineer,

engineer wrote:

A typical child's load is small in comparison and should be borne without complaint.

Should, but that doesn't mean there won't be complaints. I complained, my kid complained, I think that's par for the course.

Ceili's "two wrongs don't make a right" works for me here -- the kid was obviously obnoxious, but I think the dad was way more obnoxious. And since he's the adult, the one who's supposed to be modeling appropriate behavior, he's more in the wrong IMO.

1 Reply

@engineer,

Well, in my opinion he's just totally now "pissed" his daughter of, he thought he did before, she will be more rebelious now and hold a form of "hatred" I am sure for both of them, given her Mother also stated "put one bullet in it for me".

How is that teaching your children to respect you?

She's a kid, kids think that chores are a pain in the butt, they think that they should not have to do them, whilst being a kid, (if they are spoilt) so it poses the question to me, he has a cleaner, he spends alot on her computer, I-Pad, phone. I'm betting she's spoilt but I'm also betting she doesn't feel and hasn't felt loved, rather this is your responsibilities, nag, nag, nag, get a job, nag, nag she's 15 she doesn't have to be like he was, at his age. She is her own person.

Where I get mad is when parents expect their children to grow up idential to them.

He says "a job" he doesn't care about what that job is. What about encouragement of where 'she' wants to go in life? What she wants to be. Seems she has no direction as longs as she gets "a" job..

I think he walked away with a big smile on his face, thinking he not only taught her a lesson but expects other parents to take a leaf out of his book.

Mother " I'm teaching you to be self efficient, know how to keep things tidy so easier for you when you start your career and I'm teaching you how to cook so you don't eat burnt toast for the rest of your life, want to help me with the spaghetti? "

Would be an easier way to make a kid think that it's not "chores" but i think she is a rebel as, her Father is domineering ..

She won't be looking after then when they are old. Tough love doesn't always work, in my opinion.

My Grandmother showed me, made it fun.. My Mother instructed me, made me rebel:)

Rant over..............................

No, $1 payback as well for each bullet? pftttt , he should pay for that for being stupid. Sorry DrewDad, just picked a line without reading, on my thread Smile

It sounded funny and I hadn't read this whole thread yet Smile

1 Reply

@FOUND SOUL,

FOUND SOUL wrote:

I'm betting she's spoilt but I'm also betting she doesn't feel and hasn't felt loved, rather this is your responsibilities, nag, nag, nag, get a job, nag, nag she's 15 she doesn't have to be like he was, at his age. She is her own person.

Sorry, but I agree with him about the job. And before I continue on with that line, I'd like to ask why you think she's being 'nagged'. I also don't know that she's spoilt or doesn't feel loved - I think you're assuming an awful lot here.

Her only chores are to: wipe the counter, take dishes in and out of the dishwasher and make her bed. Oh, and do her own laundry.

Re: the job - I told my 14 yr old daughter that when she turned 15, the allowance would be cut off and she'd need a job. She started babysitting at age 12, after taking the babysitting course, so she was used to making her own money, but she was an excellent student and no extra-curricular activities so there was no reason she couldn't start to learn about working for a living. I wanted her to experience life with no education, for one thing, but I also thought, since she wasn't doing anything else, she could work. She had no problem with it whatsoever (I did give her a year's notice), and she learned good work ethics early.

Maybe this girl wants and wants and wants and 'get a job' is her dad's way of saying 'no more handouts' for those sorts of things.

We really don't know what the situation is. Is she a brat or just frustrated? Is he doing, doing, doing and not feeling appreciated? All kinds of perspectives to consider.

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@Mame,

I suppose now I have to look at this damn video.

1 Reply

@ossobuco,

All right, I watched it.

I completely get his anger.
But he has no clue re her angry recent behavior, and she probably is reacting to what she takes as a wild blur of anger herself, maybe or maybe not for a long time.
This is probably common.
I could understand him, if not agree at all on tactic, until pretty far into it.

And then I thought, oh, a sadist.

I think some of this starts early and is somewhat set in the confluence of old and new ways. Early cognizance of the family pulling together is one thing with real tasks so the family can eat - and a modern place where the kid is expected to help out by putting away dishes. I can understand a lack of grasp for the kids that is not all their fault.

I went from a kid who didn't do much - I remember helping clean, weeding, mowing, snow shoveling as I got older, and so on, but not being 'put upon', it was just how it was that we all did that, part of learning in the kitchen, to one when my parents started into trouble, who got a job and cooked, etc.

I see I was a lucky girl to not deal with these resentments.

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@DrewDad,

I didn't say "you owe me chores because i feed you." Nothing i said suggests that the child is undeserving. You're acting like a loon. Where would you be without straw man arguments?

But, i should know better . . . you're always right. Yeah, Buddy, that's it, you're always right and no one should question your judgement. Whatever you say, Buddy.

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@engineer,

Word

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@sozobe,

sozobe wrote:

engineer wrote:
A typical child's load is small in comparison and should be borne without complaint.

Should, but that doesn't mean there won't be complaints. I complained, my kid complained, I think that's par for the course.

Word again. You can expect that from adolescents.

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@Mame,

Quote:

I'd like to ask why you think she's being 'nagged'. I also don't know that she's spoilt or doesn't feel loved - I think you're assuming an awful lot here.

Quote:

Her only chores are to: wipe the counter, take dishes in and out of the dishwasher and make her bed. Oh, and do her own laundry.

Sure, if her only chores are to do the above, why has she written (2) long letters on facebook, about her parents. It means that either, she feels that she should not do anything at all, (therefore spoilt, they have a cleaner), or that she can not do anything in life, a failure, made to do chores, get a job, and doesn't have the connection with her parents (in love). If she did, she would not see the minimal chores as such a big deal remember she swore heeps in that letter that Dad, read out, according to him. And, she did it with alot of anger as well.

If a kid is loved and participates with the house, would they go to that extreme? In their thoughts? His actions shooting a computer, is showing "I AM THE BOSS" attitude and you WILL DO WHAT I SAY and learn.. That suggests to me that he dictakes.. Remember he "claims" that there is a note on the fridge with her chores as apparently she can't remember them.

How can she forget simple things, as he has claimed that is all she has to do, her bed, put dishes away either in the dishwasher or out and wipe a bench?

I may assume but I also hear what someone is stating.

Would your daughter forget those simple tasks ? Would she feel anger over such simple things and hate her parents?

Remember also he worked 2 jobs and went to College and did other things around the house, he states it.. It's his belief she's lazy, only job she applied for was one "he" sent off.. What do you think that he has told her over and over? I see that as nagging.

Then, also there is a Step-Mother and her "real" Mother said, put a bullet in the computer for me too, and so he made that known. Isn't a Mother mean't to say, "hold off, why would she write things like that about me? " "We need to sit down and talk to her, her letter was very angry, what's going on inside her mind". To react with put a bullet in it for me too, If I was her daughter and my Mother said that, and my Father did what he did and then I was grounded from any communication until College, I'd sure hate them.

The point I am getting at is, there is no communication or help to assist her get over that 15 year old problem that we all have, being a kid. They just made matters 100% times worse.

Also, maybe he is saying no more handouts, I pay for all your computer work, he really pushes that side, maybe she is stubborn, maybe she is lazy, maybe though she has an estranged relationship with her Mother as she has a step-mother and maybe Dad pays his "lady" alot of attention and not much to her, maybe she does feel un-loved.. Where as you taught your child and I imagine in a loving, happy, environment.

Maybe I just see "her" in her words and the way she wrote what she did and why she maybe that way.

I still say, she feels un-loved. And, is retaliating. Rebelling. And, I still say just from what he stated, in words and his actions, that his way of handling things has not made her feel a part of things, rather a child, who is always told off or told to do things, (order) .. His actions were proving his order, control.

In my opinion:) And, you know we all have different ones as we all think differently.

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I think they're just very dysfunctional but that doesn't mean they don't love each other in their own way. Why else would he fix her laptop, etc, and bother to discipline her? She's a teen. She's rebelling. It's natural. She has to get her dad a cup of coffee and she grouses about it. Whatever.

1 Reply

@engineer,

From another site:

Quote:

(from another thread) verbal_jizm: Seriously. If she steps over the line then he should take away the computer for an appropriate amount of time, basically setting out boundaries. What this douchebag did teaches her nothing other than that her dad is a dick and an attention whore

Actually it did teach her a few other things.

1) It's okay to act immature and destroy personal property when you feel slighted by others.

2) It's okay to belittle loved ones before everyone on the planet.

3) It's okay to misuse firearms if you're angry over something someone did to you.

4) If you get angry and destroy someones property (even if you gave it to them) then it's okay to force them to reimburse you for your destruction

5) Disrespect should always be returned and escalated.

6) Adults should never take the high road during a dispute with a child.

7) Retaliation against family members and loved ones is cool and funny

8) It's okay to pry into the personal communications of your family members if you possess the skillz to do it.

9) Once you've betrayed the trust of your children you should punish them for their immature thoughts made in private.

Gosh wouldn't the world be a much better place if we all taught our children these values?

Mr. Jackass if you're perplexed as to why your teenage daughter has no respect for you, walk into the bathroom look into the mirror and ask yourself why you taught her to be that way...

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@Mame,

I don't dis-agree that there is "love". Nor, that she is not rebelious.

Hate mail is a strong thing... And, that is what she is writing... And, usually that stems from non love, or else it wouldn't be hate.

I've answered thousands and I mean thousands, of teenagers posts where parents are concerned, I guess things stick out to me, from answering those when reading.

It doesn't really matter... All kids are different.. It's just what stuck out to me, doesn't make me right ...

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The family in the video are generally refusing media interview requests, but I did see this article today.

From the header:

Quote:

Police pay a visit to father who shot daughter's laptop in viral video over Facebook complaint - to THANK him
North Carolina father Tommy Jordan says police have come to his house after receiving calls, and have given him 'kudos'
...
In statement, refuses interviews as he does not want to benefit from incident, though has now monetized video for 'attorney's fees'

Reveals Hannah had crying fit after video went viral but 'she is strong'

On the daughter's reaction

Quote:

Q: How did your daughter respond to the video and to what happened to her laptop?

A: She responded to the video with “I can’t believe you shot my computer!” That was the first thing she said when she found out about it. Then we sat and we talked for quite a long while on the back patio about the things she did, the things I did in response, etc.

Later after she’d had time to process it and I’d had time to process her thoughts on the matters we discussed, we were back to a semi-truce… you know that uncomfortable moment when you’re in the kitchen with your child after an argument and you’re both waiting to see which one’s going to cave in and resume normal conversation first? Yeah, that moment. I told her about the video response and about it going viral and about the consequences it could have on our family for the next couple of days and asked if she wanted to see some of the comments people had made. After the first few hundred comments, she was astounded with the responses.

People were telling her she was going to commit suicide, commit a gun-related crime, become a drug addict, drop out of school, get pregnant on purpose, and become a stripper because she’s too emotionally damaged now to be a productive member of society. Apparently stripper was the job-choice of most of the commenters. Her response was “Dude… it’s only a computer. I mean, yeah I’m mad but pfft.” She actually asked me to post a comment on one of the threads (and I did) asking what other job fields the victims of laptop-homicide were eligible for because she wasn’t too keen on the stripping thing.

Quote:

In the meantime, once the initial anger passed,... she sat with me reviewing some of the comments that have come in via Facebook and YouTube. One person even suggested collecting the shell casings and auctioning them on eBay. I said I’d do it if it would help contribute to her college fund! When I told her about it, she thought a minute, got a funny calculating expression on her face and said, “in that case you should shoot my phone too.

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kids have said this sort of **** for years about their parents and lives, it's part of being a kid, was the girl dumb for making it available for all to see, sure, when i was a kid you said this **** amongst your friends and your parents were none the wiser, that being said, the dad's a douche, boo hoo, my kid talked **** about me, grow up sir

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