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Palestinian Solidarity Campaign disrupts Israeli Concert. Yeah!!!

 
 
Sturgis
 
  1  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 08:19 am
@izzythepush,
I never called a student stupid. I'd address their error and ask them to make the necessary adjustments. When they had difficulty still, I'd go through the information, step by step, item by item, piece by piece. There were never public admonishments, either in the classroom or elsewhere.

As a matter of fact, I didn't even call you stupid, I stated what you are iterating is a brand of stupidity to which you subscribe. It is a brand which prevents the eater from tasting all the facts, that doesn't make you stupid, just inadequately informed.

izzythepush
 
  4  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 09:20 am
@Sturgis,
For a very intelligent man you have acted in an entirely predictable manner. This is the argument that all Israel apologists use; talk about something else. The Palestinian Solidarity Campaign is all about justice for the Palestinians, the end of the occupation of the West Bank, and the blockade of Gaza. It is not about Israel's right to exist, or the establishment of the state of Israel.

The persecution of the Palestinian people is indefensible. So apologists like yourself muddy the water by making it about something else. Your fellow apologist Foofie, has already alluded to the Holocaust, and spoken about Europe in the 1940's. At the same time conveniently ignoring the fact that Britain took no part in the Holocaust, and that British troops liberated Belsen.

If you had taught a humanities subject that had no absolutes, you may have found yourself in the position where you disagreed with your pupils but that did not mean your pupils were wrong. It's called opinion.
Setanta
 
  4  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 01:48 pm
Certainly the situation in the former Palestinian mandate is a product of what happened in 1947. At that time, General Assembly Resolution 181, which authorized the partition, called for an economic union, minority rights, rights of transit, the equitable division of all assets, including and not limited to railways, highways, airports, port facilities and public utilities. Israel immediately violated the terms of the resolution and have done so ever since. This is not about the destruction of the state of Israel, it's about equity--equity denied since 1947.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 02:22 pm
@Setanta,
Exactly.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 02:57 pm
@Setanta,
And do you think the existence of Israel is not at stake?

What do you think about stooges for the Palestinians and apologists for Hamas?
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 03:11 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
The existance of Israel is hardly at stake. They've got the biggest military machine in the entire middle east.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 03:35 pm
@izzythepush,
That's another tactic, to portray all those who sympathise with the plight of the Palestinians as being unwitting fools blinded by propaganda. The reality is that Israel has the biggest PR machine going, constantly monitoring news reports for bias, and threatening to play the anti-semitism card at every opportunity.

Hamas is a reality, they need to be negotiated with, just like the IRA, jaw, jaw.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 03:43 pm
@izzythepush,
I'm sure Israelis are now sleeping better for izzythepush's assurance that they have nothing to fear.

georgeob1
 
  2  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 03:55 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

This is not about Jews. This is about the way the Palestinians are being persecuted on a day to day basis. This is about the illegal occupation of the West Bank and Gaza strip. Israel likes to paint itself as a democracy fighting terrorists, but it's not. It is a brutal oppressor, just like apartheid South Africa.
And like apartheid South Africa it needs to be reminded that it is not part of the free world. This was a good reminder, next we need to look to the European cup and the Eurovision song contest.

Note, peaceful protests, no arrests.


Actually the illegal occupation started in 1917 with the British invasion of the Ottoman Empire in Palestine and Mesopotamia. Imperial Britain stole the territory in pursuit of money and power, deceiving both Arabs and Zionists in the process.

I can sympathize with the Palestinians and fault the wrong-headed (and unjust) insistence of the Israelis on an expansionist and perpetually Jewish state. However, given the history of this sorry part of the world, I cannot understand Izzy's claim to be proud to be British. On this subject (and South Africa as well) shame is the more appropriate emotion.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 04:00 pm
@georgeob1,
I've got nothing to say to you. My hands are clean.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 04:18 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

I'm sure Israelis are now sleeping better for izzythepush's assurance that they have nothing to fear.


What's that supposed to mean? I doubt they're expanding illegal settlement construction because of fear.
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 05:47 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

This is not about Jews. This is about the way the Palestinians are being persecuted on a day to day basis. This is about the illegal occupation of the West Bank and Gaza strip. Israel likes to paint itself as a democracy fighting terrorists, but it's not. It is a brutal oppressor, just like apartheid South Africa.
And like apartheid South Africa it needs to be reminded that it is not part of the free world. This was a good reminder, next we need to look to the European cup and the Eurovision song contest.

Note, peaceful protests, no arrests.


There might be some South African Blacks that could be insulted if they misconstrued your comparison to mean that they are like Jew hating Palestineans.
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 05:51 pm
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:

Allowing the Zionist to establish and maintain a necessarily discriminatory and oppressive ethnocentric state is the quintessential example of socio/psychological enabling of problematic behavior caused by post-traumatic stress disorder, and the corrosive harm it causes. The issues that many of the Israeli Ashkenazim have in regard to the Holocaust and European anti-Semitism would have begun to be dealt with much more constructively had they been given the incentive to create and granted an inclusive, pluralistic and egalitarian state incorporating all of the peoples of Palestine instead of the exclusivist state that they were allowed to created based on seething indignation. Unfortunately, the mindset in Europe in regard to states and nations at the time during which the UN passed its resolution 181 was one of an ethnicity based nationalistic ideology that dated back to the 19th century and infected all the peoples therein including the Ashkenazim themselves and of course the Germans through whom this ideology saw its grossest manifestation. Regrettably, most people today still subscribe to this ideology especially in regard to Zionism (Jewish ethnocentric nationalistic ideology) and the state of Israel, and support its continued existence as the state "for the Jews" with disregard for the rights of the Palestinians and oblivion to the hypocrisy which underlies their selfsame subscription and support.


The one thing I think you left out, in your thorough analysis, is that based on the culmination of two millenia of anti-Semitism morphing into an exterministic type of anti-Semitism, with the Nazis, is that very possibly the world decided in 1948 to give Jews a pass finally, and allow them to live in a non-Gentile world (aka, Zionist Israel), for those Jews that had their fill of Christian love? Get it?
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 05:52 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

I think those who were unhappy were people who had gone to the Proms expecting a concert. I don't think being Jewish had anything to do with it. I'm proud that this happened peacefully. The Palestinian Solidarity Campaign is committed to non violence.

The BBC was asked to comply with the boycott, and non-violent methods ensured that it did. What was really clever was that the protestors were in groups. They didn't all go off at once, but took shifts, so once the first lot had been removed, and things quietened down, another lot kicked off.

The same methods employed against apartheid South Africa are now being employed against apartheid Israel.


It seems you have found some additional meaning to your existence.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  2  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 05:54 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

My hands are clean.

Many Israelis would use that defense too (and with equal justification). Would you accept it?
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 06:00 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

That's a hoot, Foofie. Another foofieism. Your pretense that you might actually care about real atrocities - you, a person who regularly makes excuses for the myriad atrocities committed by the US. You have to remember, Foofie, just who it is that has placed and supported those Middle East rulers who slaughter.

It's really quite amazing that you have the chutzpah to even show your face and advance such a notion, but then you have shown that stupidity is one of your long suits.


In my opinion, your thinking that you can stand in judgement of an American born citizen and his feelings for his country, based on your interpretation of history, is really a good definition of "chutzpah." Do you condemn any Germans for being so accepting of Nazi atrocities, or do you only condemn Americans? You do know that many card carrying Nazis continued their lives after the war, without ever giving up their beliefs. Their common attitude was Nazism was just their attempt to have an empire, no different than Britains gaining an empire. No guilt; no remorse; no apologies. Or, at least not in private.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 06:05 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

Lets instead talk about what is happening now, not what happened 50 odd years ago. Perhaps talks brokered by the UN would be a good idea. However, I can't see it happening with an idealogue like Netanyahu in charge.


Poor logic, in my opinion. History is cause and effect. If you want to start again, and ignore history, that seems analogous to a young girl's sometime attitude when she messes up while jumping rope - "It's a do over; my foot stumbled!!!!!"
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 06:07 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

Sturgis wrote:

Then again, how would you understand it since you've switched from Israel to South Africa and undoubtedly no little or nothing about either.


Just because somebody disagrees with you doesn't mean that they know nothing. I was closely involved in the anti-apartheid potests against South Africa, and am a member of the Palestinian Solidarity Campaign. I am not the only one who has likened Israel to apartheid-era South africa.


Please stop insulting South African Blacks by comparing them to Palestineans. South African Blacks did not use their own people to be suicide bombers.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 06:10 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

...The persecution of the Palestinian people is indefensible. So apologists like yourself muddy the water by making it about something else. Your fellow apologist Foofie, has already alluded to the Holocaust, and spoken about Europe in the 1940's. At the same time conveniently ignoring the fact that Britain took no part in the Holocaust, and that British troops liberated Belsen.



What is the connection with Britain's having Jewish British citizens then and now, and my belief that Israel should not be swamped by Palestineans, since the Nazi Final Solution seems to have left a population of Jews that just want to exist without the Christian love they found in Europe for two millenia?
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Sep, 2011 06:16 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

The existance of Israel is hardly at stake. They've got the biggest military machine in the entire middle east.


Well, if activists make Israel nervous in an existential way, and they do something pre-emptive, a la Masada, will any activists feel that they may have added oil to the fire, so to speak? At that point, I would not be surprised if some pro-Palestinean activists do a very good ante-Bellum South imitation, and say, "Why lil 'ol me could never be responsible in any way for what transpired. It was those obstreperous Hebrews. Stiff necked and obstreperous, ah do say. Now let me rest. Ahm plum tuckered out."
0 Replies
 
 

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