vinasp, I reposted mt original question for the curious.
"As Arnold might say, I'll be back."
How would you propose that we die b/4 we die?
By the way welcome.
I sought this post out after reading you over on Right View, Buddhism. I happen to agree with you on that topic, incidentally.
---------- Post added 01-07-2010 at 07:06 AM ----------
Hi back at ya, Vincent,
Don’t worry about me misunderstanding because of something you may say. I am purely capable of doing that without any help. ; ^ )
You need not apologize for not being a certified philosopher, with all of the bells and whistles. I am only interested in the Truth, Pure and Simple, and you seem to be in possession of some of that, IMPO.
I myself am more of a Mystic (Mutt) having studied many fine disciplines, and like Aldous Huxley come upon a “golden thread” that seems to link them all, ultimately.
I have read my share of Chan, and Zen, as well, some years back now. But, I am not so organized in that area as I imagine you are. So, I am looking forward to learning in some small way from your self in this gentle conversation.
Yes, “no self,” everyone seems to think they know what this means, don’t they? I seem to be in a minority opinion on that one. I see that as speaking of the finite self, only. So, I could easily call it a psychological death, as well, when we become Realized/Liberated. Were that it was that simple. I also have a number of connotations that follow from that original concept.
Enlightenment, talking about it can certainly be both tricky, and confusing. I think much of this comes directly out of the fact that people are often speaking on multiple levels at once, a sort of mix and match, while making no attempts to point this fact out.
We also have the added problem of people speak from the perspective of outside of enlightenment, and within enlightenment, two totally diverse perspectives, but once again throwing both willy-nilly into that original mix. No wonder it seems to be contradictory in many instances.
So of course in the beginning we need a method. We are out here in a boat without any oars. After a while, we begin to realize that what we want is already in our possession and yet covered up to such an extent by misconception that we cannot quite make it out.
So there you have it, “nothing we can do will get us enlightened,” because as Buddha said, “we were all already enlightened, and just didn’t know it,” and at the same time we need a “method” then, to get rid of this “not knowing it.”
Yes, my new friend, we are certainly speaking (not about more/cumulative knowledge), but rather of something far deeper than finite mind and her knowledge, (AKA this dream state.) Like you say, it is “Original Mind.” But, not original in any lineal sense, but rather original as in synonymous with “Essential Being.”
There is certainly some Spiritual Instinct seated deep within us, which seems to be insistent on being known.
I look forward with curious anticipation to your reply,